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Are elites wusses?

Show Profile  Dave Barr Posted: 17 June 2003, 12:09 AM  
I have become increasingly concerned about certain elites using expletives gratuitously on this forum and in public generally. As a keen supporter of our local talent it upsets me to see some people abusing their responsibilities as role-models to our younger orienteers.

Thought has to be given to the fact that this is a public forum and the contributors aren't the only readers.

Expletives add nothing to the written word. Strong writers have no use for them, and often paraphase quotes to avoid having to include them in their work. In the context that these words have been used on this forum they simply make the contributor appear to be an unintelligent oaf.

I would implore that the elites who I am referring to (and I am sure they know who they are) take a good look at themselves and their behaviour.

Edited by - Dave Barr on 17/06/2003 01:12:42

Show Profile  fancy_michael Posted: 17 June 2003, 12:17 AM  
If the 6-Day has an M21E Short-O at either Naseby or Waikia, I'm confident that it WON'T be on course 1 -and I don't care about stupid elite egos -or the fact that M21E is traditionally on course 1.
Bruce is smart enough to realise that most people who have been on those maps before, will want more than 4 or 5kms (which by the time you scale down to the shorter reds will only be 2 or 3kms!)
I hope that this 'debate' only affects the shortening of M/W21E... because I personally think the idea of a 6-Day is lots of Orienteering... not lots of rest periods.

Show Profile  ecurb Posted: 17 June 2003, 8:29 AM  
Don't worry Michael, its ONLY M21E who are being scaled down. The least that anyone else has is 90% of normal.

Can we make 200 postings? More chocolate fish on offer Rob or does it depend on your salary?!!

Show Profile  Greg Posted: 17 June 2003, 8:29 AM  
the reason hardly any females have made a posting here, and why no real comments have been made about the female Elite races is because noone really cares, our best female doesn't even really use email let alone check here and then the talent bar a few dropes off rather quickly into oblivian.

take it from the biggest events in the world the girls are there as a warm up event and to scare the animals out of the forest

Show Profile  Natalie Posted: 17 June 2003, 1:02 PM  
Thanks for that Greg, the oblivion that you were referring to which undoubtedly includes myself who spend unseemly amounts of time for ladies getting sweaty and training to be a 'warm-up event' to your greater selves (often at the very least as much time as you yourselves spend training) would perhaps like some representation.

To add my 2 cents worth, I am really looking forward to this carnival, excellent areas, exciting maps and races, it doesn't get much better! Great work Bruce, your efforts are greatly appreciated.

In my opinion, I enjoy a variety of race types and lengths. As a finisher of the mammoth Nationals Classic this year (albeit slowly and incurring injury) I think I narrowly escape being classed as a wuss, and a few good classic races would be great, but I would really like to see at least one short race as well, just to mix it up and keep the competition interesting.

As an aside, I think the reason for the lack of female response is not due to not caring about the topics, but more not caring to risk the abuse of people's opinions that is often dished out in this forum. Perhaps more people will be willing to contribute when people's individual opinions are treated with a bit more respect in serious discussions.

Edited by - Natalie on 17/06/2003 14:12:41

Show Profile  bendover Posted: 17 June 2003, 7:23 PM  
greg, you're out of order sometimes.

i reckon a fair few elite women would give you a real ass whupping when it comes to orienteering AND running.

come join us in the 21st century. either that or go beat some women over the head with a big wooden club and drag them off to your cavernous lair.

Show Profile  Andrew M Posted: 18 June 2003, 10:04 AM  

You have obviously quickly forgotten the time you ran with the girls and got beaten by the girls. .....Switzerland 2001.

Show Profile  addison Posted: 18 June 2003, 2:45 PM  
So Bruce. What exactly is the new plan for the Southern Six Day? You say only M21E being scaled down, why not all courses. Seems crazy to me to have the elites run a short run, and not let everyone else. Remember that Short O' is just as important as classics!

Show Profile  Greg Posted: 19 June 2003, 7:17 AM  
Well it got an Elite womens reply didn't it.

Show Profile  ecurb Posted: 19 June 2003, 5:00 PM  

The FINAL plan for M21E is

Naseby Day 1 - 105 mins
Naseby Day 2 - 70 mins
Rest Day
Mt Ross score event Day 3 - 60 mins
Rest Day
Cuttance Day 4 - 70 mins
Rest Day
Waikaia Day 5 - 105 mins
Overton Day 6 - 70 mins

The FINAL plan for everyone else is

Naseby Day 1 - 100%
Naseby Day 2 - 90%
Rest Day
Mt Ross score event Day 3 - varies according to age group
Rest Day
Cuttance Day 4 - 90% mins
Rest Day
Waikaia Day 5 - 100%
Overton Day 6 - 90% mins

The reason elites are having less is because they complained. No one else has complained and I would put money on the fact that most older people (the majority of competitors) would prefer to run closer to the classic distances than the little toy distances that some of you guys want.

For myself, a decrepid M50, if we reduced our EWT of 55 mins by the amount you want elite winning times reduced by then we would have an EWT of 30 to 35 mins. You got to be kidding. Who would travel for k's for that?

If you want to mess with M21E times thats fine by me but please don't even think about messing with other people grades!! :-)

Show Profile  ecurb Posted: 19 June 2003, 5:10 PM  
Finally got round to answering Stu

You said

"but it appears the Bruce Collins hatred of short events has reared it's ugly head. I know in history, Bruce, you have entered elite grades on the Short-o days to get "your moneys worth" because "you don't travel to orienteering events for only half an hour of competing".

I did it at the Nationals too running M21A for the short but that is my whole point............... If you don't like what the organisers are putting on for you in your class then run whatever class you want so that you get the enjoyment you want.

The Southern 6 Day is not going to be a big prize event. Its not important. Its going to be a fun event with good courses on good maps. Enjoy the orienteering! Look outside the rigid M21E square! Get a life some of you M21E's!

At twice your age I shouldn't be telling you to get a life!!!!!!! :-)

Show Profile  onemanfanclub Posted: 19 June 2003, 10:25 PM  
Sorry Bruce but two last (??? - OK last for now) digs that I can't resist making...

1) Here's one very-non-elite that has been consistently asking/complaining why there is no short race (that's short as opposed to classic or sprint or..., rather than short as in shorter) on the programme. By my count that's 50% of the non-elites who have been contributing to this discussion. Even if I am working in the South Island this summer I now doubt I'll be trying hard to get to any more than a day or two of this series, if that. (But then who'd miss me?)

2) I assume you'll be actively campaigning against inclusion in the Super Series, as that would kind of oblige those who consider themselves elite to run in the elite grades rather than have fun and drop up and down to get the course length they want on any given day?

Show Profile  Jamie Posted: 20 June 2003, 8:13 AM  
I'll miss you Nic

It's up to the super series management what course the elites will actually run. I'm sure Bruce will be more than accomodating, he might not even have to plan a course one on one of his days.

Bruce, I assure you a 30minute course is not a "toy course"....most running athletes only seldomly compete in a race over this winning time....elite orienteers do it day after painful day a lot of us give it death

Show Profile  ecurb Posted: 20 June 2003, 8:40 AM  
I'm sure we will be as accomodating about the super series as we were this year when we were asked if the Otago Champs weekend could be a round and then READ that it was going to be Canterbury Champs instead!!!!!!!!

Show Profile  addison Posted: 20 June 2003, 11:53 PM  
Lets all have a drink.

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