 Greg
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Posted: 9 December 2004, 8:14 AM
Wasn't the policy made so that we sent good enough people to JWOC and didn't get last. Well thats happened now and the policy hasn't been followed at all in the 4 years its been out. So why have a policy if it is not going to get used!
Which brings me back to 4 years ago - Scrap the policy! Its was made to work when there wasn't more than 6 (in either) going for JWOC, so that we didn't just send any joe bum thats a joke. The policy hasn't been followed and I think the right people have still gone as the selectors have used their judgment.
When there is more than 6 I think its normaly obvious who the top few are, pre-select them and tell the rest they have to trial at such and such before the end of Feb. (this could also be Area Champs etc)
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Marquita G
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Posted: 9 December 2004, 12:19 PM
Keith said " Congrats to those selected looks like it will be a big team". Is there another selection panel somewhere?? The official panel has selected an interim squad, not a team, as per the NZOF JWOC policy. It was announced 48 hours later than it should have been - tough titties, I was sick.
Martin said "the trial rules are not being followed". I suppose they are not but since they are completely unworkable this should not be a surprise. There are no events in February to use as a trial. Therefore we cannot have a trial in February. One year we tried to have a trial in February and only one person turned up, all the other little darlings had excuses. Since we have a major international event with several races in January this year, is there any reason why we would NOT use these races as trials? Can anyone suggest an alternative? And for those of you who are worried that all the carnival races are on classic flat Woodhill, don't be. Anyone not fit for hills will be struggling.
A suggestion has been made that days 1,2 and 5 of the carnival be used as trials so as not to disadvantage anyone selected in the ANZ or schools teams. This is the first positive thing I have seen on this thread and I think it is a good idea. Consider it done. We will also be looking at the results of day 4 as this is the biggest event of the carnival and the first use of a challenging new map. Selection is not a precise science and you can be assured that the selection panel are clever enough to work out who ran well and who didn't regardless of which grade they were running. Saying that, JWOC contenders must run M/W20 for days 1,2 and 5.
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Martin
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Posted: 9 December 2004, 1:15 PM
Keith stated "the trial rules are being ignored". Mine was "What are policies for if they are not going to be used and followed? In saying this, it is a good guideline as to what to expect to happen" - first Interim Squad, then trials, then Team selection, thhats the basis of the Policy, and what is happening now.
So how can we fix the JWOC policy so that it is workable.. a remit at the AGM? This will only work if people come forward and say what they think can be improved, then someone can look at it on the whole.
The last thing I tried to propose to NZOF officials was torn apart, not taken as an idea and positively worked on - like I hoped would have happened. Someone else can take the reins on this.
Thanks for taking note of the idea for days 1,2,5, Marquita.
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darren
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Posted: 9 December 2004, 1:35 PM
Well done Marquita.
Lay off the selectors guys, they have a hard enough job as it is!
At the end of the day its simple - if the selectors think you are good enough they will put you in the team, if your not good enough they won't!!! There's no point crying about it.
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HeadHoncho
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Posted: 9 December 2004, 10:01 PM
Martin,
"The last thing I tried to propose to NZOF officials was torn apart, not taken as an idea and positively worked on - like I hoped would have happened"
Care to elaborate? (by email if you like)
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Jamie
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Posted: 10 December 2004, 1:05 AM
I'm still not happy with the selection of the interim squad...being in the interim squad implies that you have being running well enough to get in the team if your form doesn't slip...frankly many of those named have not been.
What has happened to the comparisons with elite? The standard of junior orienteering in NZ is on the slippery slope...applying the policy would help to address that.
This message was edited by Jamie on 10 December 2004, 11:07 AM
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pcbrent
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Posted: 10 December 2004, 2:28 AM
There is a simple solution to this, all our juniors just need to get better and start beating the elites.
Next week many of them are starting up the slippery road to success by attending the anual junior camp, with some expert coaching and some harden up training.
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Keith
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Posted: 10 December 2004, 4:56 AM
I thought that the intended idea of the interim squad was that it is pretty much the team and it unlikely someone would be dropped unless the got injured/slacked off etc. Unless their was more than 6 up to standard (unlikely) which then a trial would be run. This allows for people to decide what their going to do the following year and book flights etc.
Simon - a case like yours would be considered under clause 1 The overriding princple......
Either apply the policy or the NZOF should make moves to ammend it to whatever everyone wants. When it was drafted it was disturbuted round all clubs and squads rather than being discussed at the AGM. If this happened agin it would be fine as long as the outcomes were actually used this time.
The other alternative is to scrap the policy and anyone who could afford it could go. Though people should have to meet some standard to get NZOF funding if it is avaliable.
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Michael
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Posted: 10 December 2004, 11:20 AM
I haven't seen much in this discussion that suggests a great problem with the JWOC policy. But although I'm not in charge of selection I do have an interest and anyone with well-thought-out issues is welcome to write to me.
Same as the Junior Superseries Martin. The SS Coordinator has made his comments from the schools point of view and they surely have to be considered since the proposal involved the SS Champs. I am keen on the idea, we now have to explore a series which doesn't use the schools champs, and possibly reexamine M/W20 (which like you I had previously thought was too thin.)
My inbox is open on this one too.
Michael Wood, High Performance Director.
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Greg
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Posted: 10 December 2004, 1:23 PM
Cheap coming from you Darren, when you were the main crier about the selectors decision on when the trials were ment to be
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Natalie
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Posted: 13 December 2004, 1:37 AM
Greg, I don't think that constructively suggesting alternative solutions to decisions made by the selectors or anyone else for that matter can be classed strictly as 'crying' about it - I would have thought 'crying' about it would be more like slamming the general decision without any specific or constructive recommendations - kind of like the way some people have been behaving about every decision made by the NZOF and selectors lately.
I think we should all word our opinions carefully and make sure we don't get lost in griping and whingeing all the time! Its really counterproductive, and we don't want to scare people off from wanting to be in decision making positions...suggesting things in a positive way usually is more effective.
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