 onemanfanclub
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Posted: 16 September 2002, 4:52 AM
Stepping back for a monent from the worthy debate about who is full of shit and who has grey hairs, and returning to whether or not the Super Series is doing anything...
I've just been at the Auckland Champs, where (disregarding a few last minute DNSs) the M21E grade was the largest in the entire competition (16 from memory), and the W21E entry was about 75% of the mens, instead of half or less, which may be unprecedented?? This is not just a reflection of how much of the squad is Auckland based, as there was a good representation from PAPO. This resulted in what seemed to be some pretty hot competition. Was the terrain the drawcard? Well it was better than I expected, but I'd say it would still rate 3rd or more after Woodhill or that forest north of North Shore(.. Weiti?). Last time I was at an Auckland champs on a normal 2-day weekend in a nice forest the elite entries were from memory frankly pathetic (numbers, not ability).
So is this all just one big mess of coincidence or is The SS starting to achieve something?
BTW Jamie, I did hear a few northen E's sounding more enthusiastic about Canterbury than MTBO, if they could get there.
Oh and congrats to Darren, Phil & Rachel for the wins, and in Rachel's case taking the series lead (so that's ONE non-elite who's following The SS ! It all starts somewhere)
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fancy_michael
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Posted: 16 September 2002, 12:08 PM
quote:
I've just been at the Auckland Champs, where... the M21E grade was the largest in the entire competition... and the W21E entry was about 75% of the mens, instead of half or less, which may be unprecedented??
How much of that is simply because of Air New Zealand price cuts?
Anyway... good to hear -it would be great if the Orienteering public had a succesful series to support, lifting the profile of the sport in general! :)
Let's hope that the Super Series becomes just that!
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HeadHoncho
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Posted: 17 September 2002, 2:48 PM
To quote Jamie:
"orienteering at present is focussed on running high quality events for stuff all people, this is unsustainable."
That's not my focus and I don't believe it's the focus of the NZOF. What gives you that impression Jamie?
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Jamie
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Posted: 18 September 2002, 2:06 AM
who said anything about the NZOF???
They don't run events...
Unless perhaps you count the NZ MTBO champs, which clash with an event they should be supporting, the canterbury champs...
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addison
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Posted: 18 September 2002, 6:00 AM
I think the NZOF doesnt even talk to other members.
Go look at the NZSSC Discussion. Now that is a disgrace
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stu barr
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Posted: 18 September 2002, 7:57 AM
Simon.
Grow up man! If you have a clash between rugby and orienteering you should just choose which is more important to you. You don't have to do everything all the time!
I don't think your NZOF bashing will achieve anything. Except perhaps create some enemies in places you don't need them.
If anyone is interested in a camp the week before or after the champs I might be tempted to organise one just across the cook in the Wellington and Manawatu area?
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MASH
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Posted: 18 September 2002, 8:16 AM
Jamie
What is your solution to the unsustainability problem?
This problem has been around for more than the twenty plus years I have been orienteering
and if there is an answere I'm sure it would be welcomed by us all.
Your expression of respect for Central North Islanders, Mark McKenna, Terry Brighouse,
Jim Lewis, just to name a few is most admirable and one very much shared by the Auckland
'O' fraternity and I'm sure others.
While on the subject of respect, can I suggest to all contributors on this forum a lilttle
more respect be given the NZOF. Bagging the NZOF may be taken by its officers as a critisisim of them and lets not forget they do this job on our behalf, voluntarily and in their own free time.
Just a thought. I personally concider the Rotorua/Taupo areas to have the best O terrain in NZ.
I would love to see the Nationals run every second year in this area. Would it be possible/feasable for outside the area clubs to rotate and run such events thus exposing the sport more in the area and possibly releaving some pressure off that areas clubs.
Spring, Summer, Autumn "O" yeh !
Edited by - MASH on 18/09/2002 16:23:05
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mark
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Posted: 18 September 2002, 8:45 AM
The NZOF doesn't deserve any respect. They suck.
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HeadHoncho
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Posted: 19 September 2002, 2:45 AM
Jamie - perhaps you should be more specific - if you mean orienteering CLUBS are focused on high-quality events then perhaps you should have said that.
I disagree with you - I think there are enough clubs around the country who realise running promotional events is just as important, if not more so, as running high-quality events for the traditional grey-hairs. Are you telling me that PAPO and Dunedin clubs do not place enough importance on promoting orienteering in their areas?
To clarify, WACO is running the NZ MTBO Champs, not the NZOF.
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Jamie
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Posted: 19 September 2002, 7:14 AM
sorry for your misunderstanding Rob. I think it would be almost unique, as not many other people think NZ orienteering revolves around the NZOF (except perhaps Simon).
for the record I don't have much problem with the NZOF, except that instead of producing words (strategic plans, development plans and the like) they would be better facilitating an ordered series of events particularly major carnivals and working on encouraging New Zealand orienteerings strategic infrastructure, i.e its maps, its mappers and general club volunteers
I think Mike's idea about non central clubs running events in the Taupo/Rotorua area (maybe even making maps) is a great one (maybe this is the kind of program NZOF can facilitate more actively).
Does WACO still exist???
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addison
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Posted: 19 September 2002, 9:37 AM
To all those who think I am just 'NZOF bashing', let me clarify my position. All I am doing is stating an error on there behalf. I do not intend to go out and make enemies, in fact, that is the last thing i want to occur. I belive personally the NZOF does a great job in 'most' fascets of its job. This is the one time i belive they have not done so.
And to Mikes comments about the CD area holding the nationals every two years, GREAT! Personally I would love to see my club holding an event such as that. But numbers are the only problem. My 'local club', being Pinelands, has approximetly 3 members. We want more people, but we serve such a small population and area. This is why we are joining forces with Hamilton on events etc. We have just mapped the Waihou River, and have on it the Famous Blue spring where Pump Water comes from. This is a magnificent area, and we look forward to having a large event on the map.
But we cannot do so because of the size of the club, and cannot manage the admin/planning etc. By having other clubs help run these from outside of the CDOA, perhaps we could see many more major events in the Area. I for one am trying my bit, and just held the Putaruru Primary Schools competition where we had 220 children running around a hand drawn map of the High School. But inexperience means i cannot do much more.
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Greg
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Posted: 19 September 2002, 12:57 PM
Why is ther about 4 different discussions in this one topic,
Stu when are you talkig about a camp, how about a new topic for that so people can see it first off - and I'm keen.
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HeadHoncho
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Posted: 20 September 2002, 3:05 AM
Orienteering in NZ revolves around a lot of things Jamie - clubs, competitors, volunteers and yes the NZOF too. Hence the need for clarification. You haven't answered the question by the way - can I assume you believe your local club(s) are too focussed on high quality events for stuff-all people?
I'm also having trouble reconciling "for the record I don't have much problem with the NZOF" with "yet another dorky call from the NZOF" - two statements you have made in recent days.
No surprises either that I disagree with you that all the NZOF does is sit around and produce words, and not encouraging more concrete things. If you really believe that, start lobbying to get the Council sacked and replaced with people who don't sit on their butt and push paper.
Facilitating major carnivals? In the last 2 years, we've asked for clubs to express an interest in: (a) a World Cup race in 2006 (b) the ANZ Challenge in January 2005 (c) possible APOC /ANZ Challenge combined with World Cup in January 2008. Response? absolutely zilch. It's pretty hard to facilitate something when there's no desire for it to happen.
Yes WACO still exists.
The facility is already in place for stronger clubs to help weaker clubs - we've publicised (more than once) that we are keen for part of our Development budget to be spent on helping weaker clubs through stronger clubs providing support, but no bites. You can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink.
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Jamie
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Posted: 23 September 2002, 2:24 AM
as someone who has put his name forward for a couple of NZOF positions, albeit (unsurprisingly) unsuccessfully I reserve my right to criticise.
having recently changed clubs to DOC (and not been very involved) I don't have any right to comment, as for PAPO they are a very successful club who have the biggest turnout to events (not just the 200+ members) of any NZ clubs. They are also technically the worst club in NZ, might as well make myself some more enemies!!. Witness the 2001 Canterbury champs and 2002 Nationals...they also have the least inspiring terrain...so whats the lesson? taking orienteering to the right market?
But then, this year the canterbury champs were nearly cancelled for lack of planner/controllers, a large club is not necessarily a healthy club, how to get the balance?
I don't think the PAPO model is anymore sustainable than the typical orienteering club, as in the central North Island the volunteer worker force is declining, and I challenge the NZOF to put forward a policy that addresses this issue
our sport needs restructuring. How about the NZOF transforms into a centralised map owning/map-making body, with clubs hiring maps to run events. This will reduce the monopoly local clubs have on orienteering in their region, consequently freeing up the orienteering market. While consequently consolidating economic resources.
For what the NZOF is it does a good job, but is it really serving a purpose, let alone a pivotal role as it could in NZ orienteering?
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Melissa
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Posted: 24 September 2002, 4:57 AM
The New Zealand Mountain Bike Orienteering Champs entry form is now available online at the new Zealand Mountain Bike Orienteering website Link. More information is available at the event website Link.
Edited by - Melissa on 24/09/2002 12:59:23
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