EEC Reference group

Alistair Posted: 5 June 2003, 1:58 AM   Jenni & I have been selected by the NZOF to represent NZ for the IOF's EEC Reference Group. More information about what the group does etc can be found here: http://www.pf-c.dk/mailman/listinfo/iof-eec-reference Whenever there is points for discussion I will endeavour to raise them here so YOU can give YOUR opinions so that it won't just be Jenni's and mine that are submitted. Of course if you don't say anything then we'll just assume that you agree.   Alistair Posted: 5 June 2003, 2:02 AM   The following was submitted by Frauke in April - unfortunately due to the slow moving bureaucracy we live in, we didn't know about it, but here it is anyway: I want to discuss the future of the World Cup with you! Following are 3 World Cup issues: program, rule changes and scoring system. Please read carefully and comment/discuss! ***World Cup program*** The following is planned for 2004 and 2005, and outlined for the following years: - World Cup is organised every year (see $ 3.5 in new Foot-O rules) - WOC is part of the World Cup - In 2004, EuOC is part of the World Cup - There are 3 World Cup "rounds" each year. Each round is at one site/country. Each round has a sprint, middle distance, long distance and relay. - The first round is in spring/summer. The second round is in summer/autumn, and this is WOC. The third round is WCup Final, in autumn. (Sorry, northern hemisphere seasons.) - There are direct qualification races for all individual races. Only exception is WCup final, i.e. the very last race. For the individual World Cup, this gives a total of 9 races: 3 sprints, 3 middle distances and 3 long distances. ***World Cup rule changes*** Now to some details that are changed in the new Foot-O-rules: - Normal WCup team size is 6 women and 6 men. All 6+6 may start in each qualification race. BUT in the WCup races that are WOC at the same time, only 3+3 are allowed to start... - The number of A-finalists is reduced to 45. (2002, it was 51. 2000 and before, it was 60). At the same time, EEC would like to cut out B-finals: nobody seems interested in them, neither runners nor spectators/press/others. Is that OK? - The winning times for long distance are getting longer and longer, as WCup now has the same winning times as WOC (70-80 min for women and 90- 100 min for men). - The winning time for middle distance is 35 min for both men and women. - The start interval for long distance is 2 minutes. What do you think about these changes? Are they improving World Cup? Please discuss! And: your opinion may still have an effect on the new Foot-O-rules if you communicate it through your federation until April 14th!!! (See my earlier e-mail on Foot-O-rules.) ***Scoring system*** Another thing EEC discussed in January is the scoring system for World Cup 2004. Although we were not all of the same opinion, we decided to suggest that ALL races should count for the overall World Cup. As this is a major change to IOF policy, Council will discuss this in its meeting 25.-26. April, and make a decision. Arguments FOR counting all races were: - The winner of the WCup should be the most all-round runner. So all races should count. - It should not be possible to win WCup without participating in WOC - Participation in WCup final round should be attractive to the best runners (i.e. some federations may be liable to go to WCup final with their B-teams, as the A-teams have been competing in both EuOC and WOC and are satisfied with that...) - It should be easy for media to calculate points during the final round (no "if"'s and "when"'s, just straight addition of points) Arguments AGAINST counting all races were: - Sick runners are "forced" to start - WOC allows only 3+3 starters. So, only very few runners will get the possibility to complete all races - IOF policy has been that a runner shall be able to win the World Cup with participating in 2 of 3 rounds. This is a money-saving thing, e.g. when one of the rounds is overseas (for europeans...). Sixten Sild had a suggestion on how to fulfill some of the "FOR" arguments without counting all races: Count 4 of 6 races from the first 2 rounds, and all races from the final round. What do you think? Discuss! Best regards, Frauke   Alistair Posted: 5 June 2003, 2:15 AM   Other countries replies can be read here: http://www.pf-c.dk/pipermail/iof-eec-reference/2003-April.txt Even though it may be too late to submit any comments about the above - I will do it anyway - in a few days. My opinions on some of the issues are: -->The number of A finalists should NOT be reduced to 45 - it should be at least 60. -->I'm undecided on the value of B' finals. -->Winning times should be kept to 85-90 (men) and 65-75 (?) for women (not 100 - we'll have to start running for 120 in NZ otherwise ;-) ) -->The 2 minute start interval should only be used in classic races if there is a form of splitting in the course (like the butterfly model). -->Not all races should count in the final points (allowance for illness) but I think it's ok to include more races than there would be presented in running only 2 of 3 series. I'm not sure how long the WC will continue when WOC is every year (which I strongly disagree with) but the current WC model seems unsustainable and will probably turn into a mostly European cup (with a few resident foreigners).   onemanfanclub Posted: 5 June 2003, 4:44 AM   When the triathlon world champs was in Wellington a few years back, I got the impression that it had been devalued by also being part of a world cup (or whatever the equivalent series in tri is). I remember several top competitiors that having dropped off the pace, rather than trying to push really hard to get back in the race because they wanted to be world champion, pulled out because they were still in with a chance for the cup and didn't want to bugger themselves with another round coming up in a few weeks. Will the same thing happen in orienteering if the world champs are part of the world cup?   Chris Forne Posted: 5 June 2003, 12:14 PM   I think B finals should be kept for two reasons. 1. If you stuff up the selection race you still get a chance to prove yourself. -coming 1st in the B finals is still a worth while goal and is much harder than coming midway in the selection races. 2. Having another race makes the travel expenses more worth while, expecially for competitors such as myself. Chris   stu barr Posted: 5 June 2003, 12:24 PM   Chris, be positive! I am sure the A final will be worth your money!   Chris Forne Posted: 6 June 2003, 4:14 AM   Yes I guess that did come across a bit pesimistic. Actually I'm reasonably confident of doing O.K, but for those who miss out I think it would be good/fun to have another race, especially if they don't have any more events. When I was referring to myself, I was referring to the travel expenses. Most teams usually don't have to travel so far, or have team funding. O.K, this doesn't really sound much better. Oh well, too bad. Chris   Barbour Posted: 6 June 2003, 11:59 PM   Agree as usual with Als notes on WCup. 60 runners would give a better spread of nations. Not sure having to attend all three series(or part of) makes ense when this means you must be selected for WOC which allows conflict between having 3 and 6 in a team and makes half the normal WCup field ineligible overall. Greg B